Suggest your Skill Tree

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by Siddharth353 on Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:21 pm

So finally mr. ryu is here lol really nice skill advises there loved the stormblast one Smile

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by archon256 on Sun Dec 16, 2012 11:38 pm

I dunno if Sigma wants people commenting on other people's suggestions here or if he wants to reserve judgment himself, but I'll do this one for now.

@@ryu wrote:
LINK : http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/barbr.png/
Lots of problems with this one...

1. This has been discussed many times - Stances cannot be put on LMB without changing them from auras into buffs. Changing them into buffs will be a nerf for builds that involve rapidly switching between stances (since you will no longer be able to switch with just one keypress, now you'll need to press the key and then use up a cast animation to cast the skill). As this basically sacrifices skill-switching 'skill' for player convenience, I am against such a change.

2.
a. The knockback from Leap Attack is worse than stun from Thunderslam.
b. The move speed of Leap/Leap Attack is fixed and independent of your character's move speed. A late game barb using 1pt Wolf Stance will be much faster than one leaping around the map slowly. The necro skill Angel of Death also has this problem.
c. The only advantage Leap Attack has as a movement skill is that you can use it to leap over gaps. You can do this much better with Blink (from Char Orb/Pax Mystica) and Jitan's Gate.

3. This is actually a pretty big nerf for SB (few targets hit max instead of unlimited), and the auto-targeting reduces the value of aiming.

4. Whirlwind is actually a really bad skill in MedianXL. Unlike in Diablo 3, Diablo 2's Whirlwind only hits a single target every few frames. This is a lot more noticeable in MedianXL where you have a ton of enemies on the screen and most primary attack skills hit multiple targets at once (EQ hits whole screen once per attack, SB hits every target multiple times per attack, SoR hits all enemies under it multiple times per cast). Compare that to D2, where nearly every Barb skill would hit just one target at a time (Bash, Concentrate, Frenzy). In a game like that WW was fine.

5. Why do you want to give the Barb QoB?

6. Screaming Eagle could use a change, sure. But since Leap Attack sucks something else is needed. How about put the QoB clone here and make it a short duration buff that periodically puts the Screaming Eagle buff on enemies near you? So you'd cast it every 15s, say, and every 3 seconds the Barb would automatically launch an axe at a nearby enemy that slows and reduces damage of enemies around it. Make the buff scale with points into the Throw tree so melee barbs don't abuse it. (Actually do throw barbs even need a skill like this? Isn't it usually the melee builds that get stuff to help them tank enemies?)





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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by MarcoNecroX on Sun Dec 16, 2012 11:42 pm

Clap Clap

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by @ryu on Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:06 pm

1. This has been discussed many times - Stances cannot be put on LMB without changing them from auras into buarding the inappropriateffs. Changing them into buffs will be a nerf for builds that involve rapidly switching between stances (since you will no longer be able to switch with just one keypress, now you'll need to press the key and then use up a cast animation to cast the skill). As this basically sacrifices skill-switching 'skill' for player convenience, I am against such a change.

>> I was not aware bout the discussion u had regarding the inability of providing stances in LMB. Thanks for clearing me out..!

2.
a. The knock-back from Leap Attack is worse than stun from Thunderslam.

b. The move speed of Leap/Leap Attack is fixed and independent of your character's move speed. A late game barb using 1pt Wolf Stance will be much faster than one leaping around the map slowly. The necro skill Angel of Death also has this problem.
c. The only advantage Leap Attack has as a movement skill is that you can use it to leap over gaps. You can do this much better with Blink (from Char Orb/Pax Mystica) and Jitan's Gate.

>>barb already have a source of stun Skill T-God, & the idea behind the Leap was about more fun based rather leaping ureh or any sort of teleport Razz
& i know that ppl will prefer this skill instead of both the skills which got replaced by Leap+Stomp

3. This is actually a pretty big nerf for SB (few targets hit max instead of unlimited), and the auto-targeting reduces the value of aiming.
>> I just tried to make people more inclined towards a strong melee/throw barb instead of skysieze/tantrum rolling all over the server.

4. Whirlwind is actually a really bad skill in MedianXL. Unlike in Diablo 3, Diablo 2's Whirlwind only hits a single target every few frames. This is a lot more noticeable in MedianXL where you have a ton of enemies on the screen and most primary attack skills hit multiple targets at once (EQ hits whole screen once per attack, SB hits every target multiple times per attack, SoR hits all enemies under it multiple times per cast). Compare that to D2, where nearly every Barb skill would hit just one target at a time (Bash, Concentrate, Frenzy). In a game like that WW was fine.
>>Frankly speaking i didn't had any idea about the mechanism of WW, I just suggested the skill cause its most popular & coolest skill of a barbarian ever made. So, if it can be made usable and powerful over median then its great.

5. Why do you want to give the Barb QoB?
>>Why not QOB ?, I rarely see any throw barbs over the server so the idea over QOB skill with some different graphics was just to add some more fun & edge to the build.

6. Screaming Eagle could use a change, sure. But since Leap Attack sucks something else is needed. How about put the QoB clone here and make it a short duration buff that periodically puts the Screaming Eagle buff on enemies near you? So you'd cast it every 15s, say, and every 3 seconds the Barb would automatically launch an axe at a nearby enemy that slows and reduces damage of enemies around it. Make the buff scale with points into the Throw tree so melee barbs don't abuse it. (Actually do throw barbs even need a skill like this? Isn't it usually the melee builds that get stuff to help them tank enemies?)
>> the skill will be useful for melee as well as throw, the idea here was to put it in throw tree so that ppl who want both the bonus must have to pay some skill points extra for that buff & i stacked the bonus in leap cause i know ppl will like to use more often , i was just not sure bout the skill timer & i left the ultimate decision for the modder.

My focus was on increasing the barbarian play-ability as well as making him more cool. so, i provided some ideas that could be possible with less changes into the current structure i didn't wanted the modder to invest allot time on a totally new skill rather than making one popular old skill playable again.
The Post says "SUGGEST YOUR SKILL" & i think i did the same Very Happy

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by MarcoNecroX on Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:33 pm

Don't worry ryu, I always take something out of people suggestions.

actually reminded me to play with some different animations from the game for new skills. Like assasin doing a backflip for a skill ;p

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by Alive@nite on Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:32 am

for the Druid or sorc
Stone Curse:All monsters lower their Armor Class when Stone Cursed, so you can hit them easily without any addition % to hit.except bosses and champions.
Ring of Fire:Creates a ring of fire around you

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by RollsRoyce on Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:34 pm

Nec could get Elemental Spell tree:

Dmg types of these Spells should be Magic/Phys

1 Passive Skill: In this case this passive should grant lak and Mag/phys spell dmg.

Lvl 1 Skill:
Phys dmg: Frozen Soul Clone, targets raise with hard skill Points

Lvl 6 Skill-Utility:
Magic dmg: Activate, lasts for 300 sec + 30 sec per hard point:
every 2 Seconds a Fist of Heaven Magic clone hits x targets on screen,
where x raises by hard points, on impact these missiles do exact the same thing as old fist of heavens, they shoot small stars that target up to 8 nearby enemies dealing additional magic dmg

Lvl 12 Skill. Single Target:
Phys dmg: Cast a small cloud at target location, from there timer starts to countdown, after 2 seconds the enemy gets hit 1 time, leaving 2 new clouds at same spot, their counter is much lower now .
If they hit again there will be additional clouds that do exaclty the same leaving more clouds ....

Recursion ( how many clouds can self proc) is limited by hard points in skill tree.

Timered Skill.

Lvl 18 Skill Passive : Energy factor to spell dmg + phys/mag spell dmg

Lvl 24 Skill:

Magic dmg: Orb of Annihilation clone, less dmg very high mana cost, dmg raises with hard skill points, Timered Skill, timer reduces with hard points

Uberskill: Passive : Grants life regeneration OR life after kill + magic Res/phys dr%

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by wow123400 on Wed Feb 13, 2013 3:01 am

Druid Hunt tree:

The great hunter does not fight along.

lvl1-hunting target

require a bow

deals 1/8 wdm,target enemies get the "prey" mark for a duration of 5 sec,those enemies got the mark gets 10% open wound,with hard skill points add 5% open wound every 10 skill points,with every 10 soft points add radius of the "prey" mark.

syg:hard point in Feast will add flat fire damage to this skill.

lvl6-Falcon attack

require enemies with "prey" mark.

deals 1/3 wdm, release a falcon to attack those enemies which got the "prey" mark, enemies get hit by the eagle -50%attack rating,every 5 hard skill points adds 1 more falcon,soft points also give falcon flat physical damage.each falcon only hit 5 times.

lvl12-Charging dogs

require enemies with "prey" mark.

deals 3/4 wdm, release dogs to attack those enemies which got the "prey" mark,this dogs got knockback on attack with 10 hit,start with 4 dogs,every 5 hard skill points adds 1 more dog,soft points gives dogs magic damage.

lvl18-Hunter's trap

Set traps on the ground,deal 1/8 wdm,and when go off,enemies in a radius of 10 will get frozen for 5sec,with soft points add flat cold damage

syg:hard skill in Feast adds frozen radius

lvl24-Feast

passive

"prey" target will explode with a radius of 10 on death,all enemies nearby will get the "prey" mark,with soft points adds fire damage on explotion.

uber skill:Hunter's nature

passive

add avoid%and speed% because hunters hide and run all the time.

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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by BassToMouth on Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:04 am

Amazon

Replace "Defensive" Tree aka passives. I've always felt that the Amazon's passives are a bit weaker and too biased for bowazon. Ecstatic Frenzy is probably one of the best ones that can be picked for making a glass cannon, yet it does nothing for Javazons (no defense = CONSTANT block recovery animation), Spearzon (death) or CasterZon (does nothing other than increase Velocity).

My general concept behind this tree is to have the first skill as a general buff passive that will benefit ALL trees. The next 4 skills will target each specific tree (i.e. bow/jav/spear/cast) separately.


  • First Skill - "Wild and Free" - Passive
    The current idea is fine, except also add IAS, FCR & some flat defense as additional bonuses that are only applied with hardpoints (like Perfect Being).


  • Second Skill - "Desolate" - Buff state skill on Attack (like Terror Strike). State itself lasts 5 seconds fixed.
    Only allows for the use of melee/buff/debuff/summoning skills. Drops enemy physical resist by -x amount (dependent on sLvl, caps at -75) in a small AoE (5 yards) in front of you for 10 seconds (same duration as Bane) but also gives YOUR character -25 DR% when this state is active (5 seconds). This will allow spearzons to break physical immunities.

    This gives them some leeway to pick some other uberskill OTHER than Curare, and also makes sense as it synergizes with the large EWD bonus from Lioness. Also means pouncezons now need to do a bit of skill switching.


  • Third Skill - "Ecstatic Frenzy" - Active Buff Skill
    I quite like this skill as it is and it compliments the bow tree nicely.


  • Fourth Skill - "Ritual of Kharos" - Active Skill
    (A bit of lore): The act of worshiping the 4th deity Kharos, who represents Death and Warfare. Many corpses of slain enemies are offered to please this dark god.

    Basically the skill creates a custom totem that generates corpses to be re-used for fairy ring. Has a skill timer of 10 seconds that gets reduced to 5 seconds max (after many hard points).

    What I also wanted to know was if this totem can last a duration of around 30~ seconds and has a "physical wall" aspect to it... If this is possible it would be cool to add that and change Ricochet back to the old one (where you need to cast it against a wall). This way even in areas without walls, we can create them and use Ricochet.

    This skill is a bit open ended as it can be used by the other trees, but I had a hard time trying to come up with something that would be exclusively useful for the Javelin tree only...


  • Fifth Skill - "Bloodwrath" - Passive that activates when struck (like Vengeful Power) for 10 seconds.
    Grants a -enemy fire resist aura (like Necro's Jinn aura, but make it only 1 yard radius so minions/party members won't benefit too much from it) + fire/magic spell% damage.

    TCD = 0% when active and drains hp 2% per second. It would also be nice if it gave the Attacker a -magic resist state (a minor value, maybe 20).

    I'm not sure if this can be coded, but if possible also grants negative IAS/physical damage (like eagle stance) when active to prevent bowzons being able to use this skill too easily.

    The reason this is the last skill in the tree is so you can skip it if you don't want it activating by accident.




Problems with current skills (why I want to replace them)
  • Fire Elementals - Various issues with this one, but the biggest issue being that it is a SUMMON that doesn't grant any buff like ice elementals (used to be useful with Gift of Inner Fire, but that got changed). Essentially with this it feels like Amazon is supposed to have 5 skill trees (bow/jav/spear/caster/summoner) but I think having too many options spreads the class too thin.
  • Balance - basically get rid of this and add it to Free & Wild. Bowzons/CasterZons won't really benefit from defense anyway since their buff skills/passive will reduce TCD to 0.
  • Defensive Harmony - I was kind of iffy on this one... I want to keep the slow since it helps all the skill trees but wasn't sure how to incorporate it in a reasonable way... Perhaps add the slow attacker effect to War Spirit BRC challenge skill (but more toned down and requires hard points to increase %slow attacker/ranged attacker).



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Re: Suggest your Skill Tree

Post by BassToMouth on Wed Feb 13, 2013 5:23 am

One more idea from me. I hope this can work but since I'm not a coder, not 100% sure if this is doable.

Druid Illusionist (I.e. Cold/Poison Illusionist)
The idea behind this tree would be to create "images" of the caster that essentially don't deal any DIRECT damage. However, when we add certain passive auras/skills to the mix we end up with a illusionist that can confuse and destroy his enemies with the power of nature.


  • First Skill - "Doppelganger" - Active Skill
    Essentially our baseline skill that will trigger all our attacks. This skill creates images of the caster that do not move (think Elvensong) but has several accompanying skills to help us deal damage.

    I'm hoping we can use a totem base that doesn't require a corpse to cast so it can inherit our %spell damage, -enemy resists, energy factor (if not, this tree is going to be hard to implement)

    Soft points = Increases Life, Damage to Attacker, duration.

    Hard Points = Starts off as a base max of 5 doppelgangers, and +1 max doppelgangers per 2 hard points.

    Casts an AoE cold spell damage skill on death.


  • Second Skill - "Gift of the Tur Dulra" Active AoE buff skill
    Applies an AoE buff that unleashes deadly poison novas at any enemies that come nearby.

    Basically this is like the sorc skill "Nova Charge" except it applies the buff to all friendly units in the area (is this possible?). So now our doppelgangers emit poison novas at enemies too!


  • Third Skill - "Thorns of the Wild" Active Aura (like stances)
    An aura that returns some fixed amount of damage to attacker. Has a flat physical and cold spell damage component.


  • Fourth Skill - "Nature's Chill" Passive Aura
    Basically the idea behind this is a "Defensive Harmony" clone to slow any enemies that attack our Doppelgangers.


  • Fifth Skill - "Illusionist's Guide" Active Familiar Summon
    Summons an untargetable raven that grants poison and cold% spell damage as an aura (like Wolf Guide) and also gives a -enemy poison/cold resist aura (like Necromancer's Jinn, so doesn't alter enemy state).



Extra Oskills to be added
I wanted more "doppelganger" types for versatility but since we only have 5 skills in the tree, hopefully these can be added to druid-only class items as oskills.
  • Elvensong - Buff this a little bit so they survive longer and essentially is an alternative to charm our enemies instead of using Doppelganger
  • Illusionary Ent - Summons essentially a "Tree of Life" except, like Doppelganger, does not attack enemies. Instead has massive life regen so it doesn't die so easily.



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