Bare-barian?

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Bare-barian?

Post by LovelyHeart on Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:45 pm

Well hello all you beautiful people, it's me again! Very Happy Hope everyone had a great Christmas and New Years!

Now that the legalities are out of the way it's time to get down to business and the reasoning behind me posting  Twisted Evil 

So, now for a new character idea that I'm sure many have already done or have insight on is a full melee barb. I understand that the damage won't be as high as the previous chars I've made (Melee Sorc- Javazon- Bowzon) due to the survivability of the class. I've read all the guides on the forums that has to due with Barbs except for maybe some hidden ones that I haven't forum trolled to find.

For early game my gear set will look like this ( Early game for me is Lv1- Lv55-65) :
TUs-
Steel Golem ( Gothic Plate)
Deadfall ( Heavy Belt)
Death Spur (Heavy Boots)
Visegrip ( Light Gauntlets)
*Haven't found a helm that I like, possibly will look into RWs thought would suffice*
These are the wep choices I was looking into. I'm leaning more towards BK Kriegs but I'm open to opinions ( Pros - Cons) of choosing those specific weps.
*Barb Weapon 1H:
Bergkaiser ( Valaska)
*Dual Wield- 2H Wep:
The Dao of Xiansai (Great Sword)
*Alternate- Dual Wield:
Bul Kathos' Teaching (Kriegsmesser)
*Accessories*
Emp Band ( Of course )
Angel Heart Ammy ( Possibly Dreamcatcher when I hit 60s )

I need some help on skill point allocation though. I want to be more melee with some AOE skills for group fighting. Also, I'm debating on stances so any advice on them would be great! Thanks for the replies! It's greatly appreciated!

* Please note that this is only for Character Lv1-65 anything higher is irrelevant to me. I'm in the process of making a Barb guide but I'd like input from the other players. All replies will help me to make a complete Lv1-120 break down of this build over time. Again, thanks a bunch! *
Threesome 
~LovelyHeart~

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by grimjerk on Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:10 pm

Didn't you ask this not too long ago?

As far as stance selection goes it really depends on what is most important to you (speed, safety, damage) and how much skill/weapon switching you want to do.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by Metalistas on Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:15 pm

Guides > miniguides > tank barbarian - http://www.medianxl.com/t1613p20-mxl-miniguides-compilation-3-post-your-own#73910

His items are top end game, but read their properties you can rethink/find similar attributes with TU, set items and make this work. You do melee atacks with shower of rock after for aoe. Great farmer, great to kill groups of monsters since shower of rocks covers some area (you can hit one monster and move to the other while rocks are still falling from the sky).

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by LovelyHeart on Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:20 pm

I asked a similar question but not to a specific class. Since survivability will already be fairly decent with resists-hp-def I'll need to pick up some slack for my damage so I'll most likely be wanting to go to a more damage related stance.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by Quirinus on Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:44 pm

More like Bear-barian Mr Green

Heres my 'slighty' old build (and its missing endgame concepts/stuff) now i do some things differently, and i do new things that i learned, but most of it is still very useful:

@Quirinus wrote:http://www.medianxl.com/t2593-first-time-player-using-barb#54741

in short, how I play melee barb:

Skills

At the start use earthquake and snake stance and wolves. Later use this:

Skillplan Melee Barb (Barbarian, 2012 v005)

You use Bear stance for the extra defense and to get damage reduction to 50% (that's the max, keep just enough points in bear stance to have 50% together from items - mainly the invictus shield and jitan's kamon armor)

Then when you get good enough gear and stuff (mainly enough defense, damage and >35-40% damage reduction from items), switch to something like this:
Skillplan Melee Barb2 (Barbarian, 2012 v005)

As for attacking:

  • Every like ~9s you hit once with Titan Strike (innate skill that gives stats and regeneration).
  • Main attack stormblast.
  • 1 hit of shower of rocks (SoR)when you run in a new big mob, to apply the debuff.
  • but use SoR in combination with stormblast when there's a tough mob.

Try to time it so that you use thunderslam after the stun from thundergod stops to keep monsters stunned. that will result in monsters being stunned like 1/2 to 2/3 of the time.

Stats
enough str/dex to use items.
enough dex (or ar mo/runes) to have a good chance to hit most monsters (>75-80%)
rest into vita.

Items
for TU (tiered uniques) items, it should be:
Invictus barb shield (from the gift box) - you should get this to T6 (tier 6) asap/priority for the defense and %damage reduction, most important item on the barbarian, this item is so good you'll use it in the endgame in 90% of the cases

>> Bul Kathos kriegsmesser barb sword (from gift box) - get this to T6 quickly as well, but 2-3rd priority, great item, decent damage, proc and has ~1-2s 100% heal oskill - inner fire, use it often to heal; keep in mind it shares a timer with thunderslam! if you have a better weapon, this one is good to keep on switch for the heal, until you get the 2 motw axes (below).

>> Jitan's Kamon (Splint Mail) - you can get it with the unique create recipe or just get a gift box with the barb, make a druid character and give the box to it to open, you'll get this in it. it's amazing, lots of elemental damage AND, what we love in this build, ~10%DR when T6. this is 2-3rd priority to get to T6.

>> gloves:
Featherclaw (Chain Gloves) - awesome gloves for early game, have everything you need (except proc), I love them for the %R/W. good %AR and %IAS as well.
Toorc's Gift (Heavy Gloves) - good proc and damage, but I prefer Featherclaw.

>> boots:
Lionpaw (Chain Boots) - for fighting, stats and defense.
Rabbit's Foot (Boots) - for farming and general use, I usually keep them on most of the time for the %R/W, %MF and lots of MO space.

>> belt:
Deadfall (Heavy Belt) - most people use this one for the SoR proc (and %CB), it's a great choice, but my personal preference is this one:
Dragon Tail (Plated Belt) - I prefer it because of the %R/W speed mainly, then there's %ias and fire damage as well as a somewhat okish proc.

>> for helm:
Thunderdome barb Assault Helmet - decent choice, there's no other choice except this and RWs.

>> amulet:
get a +1 lucky recipe amulet asap at the start.
Angel Heart - all nice stats.
Athulua's Oracle - nice.
Teganze Pendant < The Dreamcatcher - both decent.
later in the game you'll want either a good Sacred amulet or a good rare amulet with +4 skills (3 + 1 lucky) with good other stats. reroll at the a2 dragon for it.

don't forget to try lucky recipe on them:
Amulet: +1 to All Skills

>> rings:
Ring of Disengagement - sick good for the start, also good for MO.
Noob Loop and Myokai's Path - obviously good if you have it from the start.
Ring of Truth - awesome!!
Empyrean Band - godly. (try to get the lottery bonus on this one in the late game (+1 skills), especially if it's a perfect one - you can even trade it, it's a decent trade item)
Ripstar/Earth Rouser - pretty ok, but I prefer Empy band or rare.
in the end, you'll want:
1 or 2 rings with +1 skills magic/rare ring (start at req lvl 30, ilvl 36), gamble or just pick up all rings, then mo it with stuff.
later gamble like a madman (or dragon roll it) to get a rare one with +1 skills and more good stats. if you get just 1 of these, empy band is the second ring.

Alternate items (RWs):
>> Ith body armor, then zod body armor, Steel Golem (Gothic Plate), but jitan kamon is superior.
Nih body armor - sick good DR% and other godly stats, really love this RW; this is a more defensive alternative to Jitan's Kamon.

>>Ral helm - dat %R/W speed and celerity proc, really good early game item.
then Fal barb helm - sick good, %R/W speed, %ias, %fhr - good item, but get Thunderdome TU when you can.

>> Eth belt - good early game.
Vith belt - really good defensive item (high defense and %DR), keep this instead of the TUs for a more defensive version.

>> Pul gloves - +2 skills and a proc, decent, but Featherclaw/Toroc's Gift is prefered.

>> Ath boots - 5% DR, +1 skills, and other stats, lvl 90 for 10 lvl more mo space. really good choice.

>> weapons:
El weapons - good for the start.
Dol and vith weapons - pretty good, but at this point you'll be using Bul Kathos sword, which is infinitely better.
Ix war hammer - LOL item, this can rival Bul Kathos Teaching sword in damage and utility. the main feature is obviously glatial nova proc which freezes the whole screen (except unfreezable monsters), making everything virtually permalocked between glatial nova/thunderslam/thundergod. used to be waaaaay better back when amazons in TA were freezable, and when Fauz was easier (monsters in fauz are freezable, so this makes it a lot easier to survive there xD). really good other stats as well, cold dmg, MO space (only lvl 81), dmg, %ias, %buff duration for increased glatial nova duration.

>>>> don't forget that a lucky recipe is a must on rws (try them on TUs as well), you can just easily reroll them until you get it:
Armour: +40% Enhanced Defense and/or Damage Reduced by 1%
Weapon: +40% Enhanced Damage and/or 100% Bonus to Attack Rating
Jewel: +2 to Strength, +2 to Dexterity, +2 to Energy, +2 to Vitality

>>>> for some TUs you can try the lottery recipe in the endgame and reroll them until you get it, like:
Unique/Set Weapon: Ignore Target's Defense
Unique Ring: +1 to All Skills
and these 2 depending on the situation:
Unique/Set Armour: Increase Maximum Life 5%
Unique Amulet: +5% to All Maximum Resistances

>>>> I suggest crafting a decent bow with the tantrum oskill +(15 to 27) and helm with +(18 to 29) to Kraken Stance for farming uberbosses (especially summon), for kraken, it's important to get it as close to 29 as possible. (get habigami TU arrow quiver with the tantrum bow, try to lucky all 3)
>>>> I also suggest crafting 2 hammerhead axes (barb 1 hand axe) with mark of the wild (motw +18 to 24) for increased damage and keeping them on switch.

Set items
Witchhunter's Hood cap - LOL godly item, and it's a cap, meaning it drops pretty often, virtually every stat on this item is sick good. if you get your hands on this one, you'll probably be wearing it a long time, unelss some really good SU drops.
Ravine Horned Helm (Sacred) barb helm - pretty good one, but drops rarely, so you'll get Witchhunter's Hood a lot before - which is also a lot better.
Celestia's Ribbon belt - 5%DR, but I still prefer the vith belt.
Eruption, snowstorm barb swords are pretty ok, but Bul Kathos isn't far behind because of the heal and MO space it has much more utility/survivability.
Hunter's Claw Fist - pretty good ok, but I prefer Bul Kathos.
Hunter's Camouflage - decent stuff, but I prefer Invictus because of more defense and MO space.
Hunter's Trackless Step - pretty good boots, 5% DR is awesome, but comparable to Ath boots, which have more MO space.
Sacred Charge Hammerhead Axe (Sacred) - pretty good stuff.
Cinadide's Bender Gauntlets (Sacred) - good choice, damage, better than featherclaw.
Cinadide's Anvil Plated Belt (Sacred) - damage. it would be awesome if it had %DR, but as it is, alternatives with %DR are better.

Ultimative/realm set items - most are godly...
xarugas' Dominion Full Plate Mail (Sacred) - speeds, defense and 10% DR, awesome!
Stealthmaster's Triumph Heavy Belt (Sacred) - Nightmare proc!!!! prevents enemy healing, really useful against healing bosses (must have vs some).
Greg's Silent Scream Light Gauntlets (Sacred) - 10% DR on gloves !?!? plus ok other stats?? godly.
Natasha, the Assassin Gothic Plate (Sacred) - LOL. no words. (5% avoid AND 10% DR, and speeds/defense)
MISSINGNO, the Paladin Plated Belt (Sacred) - lightning! good for stormblast, would be even better if it had DR%, but as is, I prefer other items.
Laz's Chasuble Light Plate (Sacred) - only if you need max res, but there's more common sources for it than this. 5% DR.
Apeskull Bone Helm (Sacred) - pretty good for damage, but no %DR.
Apefoot Boots (Sacred) - decent, but comparable to ath boots.

I won't really go into sacred items, grws and elemental rune rws, because there's a lot of them and you can experiment and compare them to your items.



in character orb you want apples and rubys for the life steal % and life on melee attack. ith/skull for defense is ok, but you don't really need it on a barb. once you are able to get the CC, put one in for +1 barb skills. oil of Jewelcraft for mana after kill, but I usually prefer the mana on melee attack MO in weapon. for the rest, just check the reagent table and see if you need it.

mystic orbs (MO)
for TU/RWs you can do pretty much anything you want, but with sets/sacreds you must be more careful and use runes for things that you can instead of MO, since you can't just reroll them.

at the start, mo weapon with mana on melee attack so you can constantly attack with earthquake. then add life on melee attack to keep your hp up.

pretty much you want maxed resistances at all times, so mo them at the beginning, then later switch to resistance runes.
mo Invictus with defense %. mo everything with -% enemy lightning res for stormblast. I like to mo some items with % uninterruptable attack as well. weapon usually %damage and spike nova proc. amulets/rings -%lightning res, thunder hammer proc, can't remember everything right now.

for sockets
at the start, use tal runes to get stats to wear items. ith/skulls in weapon to get dmg.

later keep like 90% runes in your item, maybe a few jewels that are really really good, you need the runes for the runemaster defense bonus (can't use too many rws because of many jewels, unless they have better defense or low number of sockets). you want runes with %damage in weapons, %defense in the shield, % resistance runes, and anything else you need (%mf).
if you use jewels for rws, craft them (nas seem ok depending on other slow sources, thai, nih, ber) and lucky them.
or reroll good rare ones with the destruction a2 dragon.
get indestructible, otherwise it's annoying to repair them all the time (costs a lot).
jewels with -% enemy lightning res, life and vita are nice.

challenges/ubers
this all worked well on MXL, it's a bit harder on Ultimative, and I didn't have too much time to tweak it much. for example, I was able to do Duncraig (old one where you needed teleports) with TU/RW gear on my barb, it was hard, but doable.

level challenge 0 (LC0) is easy with earthquake and poison stance (if you really want, you can buy a bow and range it while hiding behind something T_T). LC1 should be a joke with bear stance. LC2 is funny with wolf stance, hit and run (especially if you cheese with the summoning spot T_T). ennead challenge is easy with bear stance (ignores undead physical immunities) and wolf for running. black road challenge is easy (for fauz you can use ix war hammer to freeze everything if you're having problems).

you should be able to complete most of the MXL ubers with no SUs with this build. and all but 2-3 with SUs (you can finish all if you really specialize items/builds and try really hard/be creative). most of the ultimative ubers are really hard, but they're doable with the right build (except maybe a few).

keep in mind that a more skilled player will be able to do a lot more with pretty much the same tools than an un-skilled one.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by FrostS on Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:03 am

Hatred-terror melee barb miniguide:
max sor, max bear stance, 2nd wolf, several points in spirit guide. Equip what u find, uptier items when u want, mo with %ed and +vit, keep 75 all res.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by LovelyHeart on Wed Jan 15, 2014 4:27 pm

@Quirinus

You know I never even thought about using a shield for my barb. It makes sense though, almost all the skills that he has uses only one hand to strike it doesn't alternate unless it's auto attack and bloodhatred if I'm not mistaken. I really like the idea of stun locking groups of mobs.

So you prefer Jitans over Steel Golem only for the %DR and Ele Dmg? I was using Steel Golem for the %CB and %FHR and %Str - %Vit

My original thoughts was high Vit and Def and Dual wield for dmg but that doesn't seem like it should be my plan now.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by grimjerk on Wed Jan 15, 2014 4:54 pm

Playing melee barb well is all about using all the tools in your toolbox. Also I am not a big fan of overdoing defense here. Ctbh will never drop below 5% so anymore defense is a waste. With one point in SoR you can easily hit -50% enemy AR. This is the same as doubling your defense against the debuffed monsters.

A great tool that opens a lot of options for you is Cautious Strike. It can let you use a Stance other than bear and still have epic dr and defense or it can let you use Neph Weapons and still have epic defense. I willbpost specific numbers later when I have access to the game.

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by Quirinus on Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:16 pm

Invictus is just too godly not to think about using it.  It's better than a LOT of SU, and it's just a normal TU. xD
The question should always be: When NOT to use it? And it's a hard one, but some 2H weapons are worth it for the killspeed (more dead monsters faster = less damage to you), if you have good DR%.

Steel Golem isn't bad, but 10% DR and (723-1440)-(1443-2880) total elemental damage is just too godly. It's the same thing as with Invictus, you should be asking when not to use it, instead of when/if to use it.

Plus, it's a way better choice later when you switch to Wolf Stance, because then you lose the DR% from Bear Stance (so you need to get it from somewhere else), and you don't really need the CB% from Steel Golem once you're using Wolf Stance (it gives tons of CB%).

FHR% and Vit% are nice, but you can get them from other sources (especially Vita), while you can't really get elemental damage that easily.



Yea, only BH uses 2 weapons. You can always use the 2 motw axes on switch to hit a few times to charge up BH for healing.

Yea, Vit and Def is a good plan with Barb, but think about it this way:
2H weapon = 1 item, 1H weapon and shield = 2 items.

In most cases having 2 items instead of 1 will give you more stats (vit/def/other) and mo/sockets, which you can use to get even more vit/def with runes/jewels. It's especially obvious since runemaster benefits greatly from having 1 item instead of 2, because you can add more runes in.

The only 2H weapons I'd consider are those that have either:
sick sick damage (~1.5-2k)
or
sick defensive modifiers (DR%, Avoid%), probably combined with some other decent stats
or
sick sick proc (like Yaggai's stormblast proc)
or
some combination of those (don't need to be as strong in the particular area, as long as there's at least 2 of the above)

edit: Grim posting before me again. XD
Yea, Cautious Strike is good. (might be nerfed a bit, soon? xD)

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Re: Bare-barian?

Post by grimjerk on Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:23 pm

If he nerfs cautious strike I will never upgrade again. I don't use any of the currently buggy stuff anyway.

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