Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by GregMXL on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:14 pm

I wish we could have PlugY pages linked to our inventory like with our stash. I did suggest to whist regarding Sigma about the ability to shift click items that you want to go directly to the cube while you're busy fighting and farming. I think he said he could do it though I'm not sure if he'd want to.

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by RollsRoyce on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:17 pm

Nope but whist got an awesome solution to cycle problem Very Happy - im sure once people would know it this thread would stop

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by Jelle on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:22 pm

@archon256 wrote:inventory space is a bad thing to make a tradeoff for

This  Exclamation 

Also please note that uber boss charms aren't just charms. They are trophies displaying your success in the game and this is exactly what makes them fun to have. To be honest, I would keep every single one of them even if they gave no bonus at all.

Cycles, on the other hand, are displaying rng and therefore only valued by what they do instead of what they stand for.

edit:

specifically for macro:

Your entire argumentation builds on the two classic assumptions that people are rational and that the utility of a person isn't partially relative to what other people have. Both which are (experimentally) proven wrong:

1. People are NOT rational. Which in this exact context means that they might value charms based on other aspects than purely stats (^read above).
2. The utility of a person is directly affected by the relative consumption of other people. In this case giving some people the chance to achieve higher level of power automatically results in the rest having a lower utility due to relatively lower power. Therefore not having cycles in the game is not equal to not using them for those who dislike the feature.


Last edited by Jelle on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:46 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by whist on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:23 pm

@RollsRoyce wrote:Nope but whist got an awesome solution to cycle problem Very Happy- im sure once people would know it this thread would stop

I know right. Razz

Although I usually try avoiding saying Sigma will fix X thing by doing Y thing in threads like this, because that still doesn't fix it in MXLU (and therefore makes it a semi-unhelpful argument). But since it was mentioned, Sigma will have a separated inventory space meant for cycles, therefore not taking up any inventory space, while also being limited (so that they do not get too strong). The allocated space for cycles has yet to be determined.

I could even go as far as having a separated inventory space for charms in general (although I'm still limited by the inventory page size at some point so I'm not sure whether it would work or not), but we will see that later.

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by RollsRoyce on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:34 pm

offtopic:Also whist im still waiting for item thread Very Happy

ontopic: whist is the MAN

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by grimjerk on Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:48 pm

Wbat I was saying was that the space agrument is trivial especially since there used to be less space and more multi cell charms.

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by pa5call on Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:03 pm

@inventory space:
It is the greed that kills the gambler  Wink

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by archon256 on Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:37 pm

@RollsRoyce wrote:just a random question:

@archon how many thousands of good cycles you found already ? Cause i did like 10-15 runs and so far kept 1 Very Happy
Irrelevant.

@grimjerk wrote:Wbat I was saying was that the space agrument is trivial especially since there used to be less space and more multi cell charms.  
Uh no, it's the exact opposite. The space argument was always valid, and that was the reason behind the reduction in charm space. Players always want more inventory space, and modmakers should do their best to accommodate that.

@GregMXL wrote:I don't get it. Alot of the end game in this mod is optional.

@archon256 wrote:
@Metalistas wrote:Inventory space is private matter, more like how i clean my room, how i do dishes, how i manage my char's inventory. You do what you want with it - keep a 2x4 for a single item that you are trying to farm or sort your stuff out the way you like it. Cycles take your 'precious' space - sell them. They are vital for your build - keep them.
This is the "it's your choice"/"it's optional" argument again.

Let's say you're a game designer deciding whether to add a new feature to the game. It's known that the feature will irritate X% of the playerbase, while the other 100-X% won't care. Does that mean you can just add the feature and the X% won't bother to use it? Not if it's any sort of goal-focused game. What's going to happen is that a lot of the X% will end up using it anyway because it makes their characters better, but they're not going to like the downside. You've increased dissatisfaction.

Of course in the end you might decide that the increased satisfaction of the 100-X% outweighs the X% that are annoyed. And the only way you can determine that is based on the feedback of those who were annoyed. Hence the thread.
Jelle says the same thing in different words on this page above.

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by Soponator on Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:55 pm

@archon256 wrote:
@grimjerk wrote:Wbat I was saying was that the space agrument is trivial especially since there used to be less space and more multi cell charms.  
Uh no, it's the exact opposite. The space argument was always valid, and that was the reason behind the reduction in charm space. Players always want more inventory space, and modmakers should do their best to accommodate that.

not. people would also want more drops and more overpowered items, but thats not the point of the game AGAIN. from the CLOD space to the MXLU space there is an enormous jump, you really want more? how much more? 999.999 pages? cmon, one thing is a serious proposal and another thing is just being spoiled...with all charms you still have the same inventory space than Clod without any charms. 4 of the biggest items. you really want more??!! you got a stash man, use a bloody tp and store stuff(not even talking about the cube). its like "item filters" you got a catalyst of destruction for that too.
i could agree to ask politley for a multipage(or one for all chars) stash in REALM, but i wouldnt even argue if the answer was no, because im just asking for that cause im too lazy to mule.

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Re: Suggestion: Please remove cycles from the game

Post by zaphodbrx on Mon Feb 24, 2014 6:01 pm

@whist wrote:
@RollsRoyce wrote:Nope but whist got an awesome solution to cycle problem Very Happy- im sure once people would know it this thread would stop

I know right. Razz

Although I usually try avoiding saying Sigma will fix X thing by doing Y thing in threads like this, because that still doesn't fix it in MXLU (and therefore makes it a semi-unhelpful argument). But since it was mentioned, Sigma will have a separated inventory space meant for cycles, therefore not taking up any inventory space, while also being limited (so that they do not get too strong). The allocated space for cycles has yet to be determined.

I could even go as far as having a separated inventory space for charms in general (although I'm still limited by the inventory page size at some point so I'm not sure whether it would work or not), but we will see that later.

Like +111111

Separation of inventory from charms is a very good feature.

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