Most Underrated build

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by The Big Ouchy on Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:10 am

For sin you can get bloodlust on claws, some gift of the wild proc somewhere, shadows from dar al harb rw (or w/e its called) and if you don't mind fiddle-fucking around with it, you can lay down phasebombs every so often and go spell based reanimates.

Then again necro has bane, 2 buff totems, shadows, jinn, burning veil, dark power, kraken stance (if you can get the friggin sinwar!!!!!), acid fiends (talon of trag oul) and bloodlust & gift of the wild from an act 5 merc so necros basically win the reanimator fight. All that's without even considering the fact that he has access to sacrifices rather than having to get it from an amulet.

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by cowking on Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:23 am

Reanimates are not even remotely viable DPS for a necromancer, no matter how much you buff them. Damage is simply too low.

@The Big Ouchy wrote:Then again necro has bane, 2 buff totems, shadows, jinn, burning veil, dark power, kraken stance (if you can get the friggin sinwar!!!!!), acid fiends (talon of trag oul) and bloodlust & gift of the wild from an act 5 merc so necros basically win the reanimator fight. All that's without even considering the fact that he has access to sacrifices rather than having to get it from an amulet.

Bane has a CD that conflicts with Sacrifices and Jitan's Gate. You need a panic teleport, you can't cast Bane or Sacrifices for 10 seconds.

Totems need to be moved around manually unless you want to recast them 24/7 (after all, you want to keep your totems behind your minions so they're not instagibbed). This means you will be porting around with Bend the Shadows, giving you -50% DR, with no block, crappy defense, and no avoid. Also, your reanimates won't teleport with you.

Djinn's won't survive 5 seconds without full minion life/res dedicated gear. In fact, even with full minion gear, a lifespan of 5 seconds is probably a good estimate. Sadly, this will mean your defense is non-existent, due to absence of Death Ward.

Reanimates are not 'leashed' minions that follow you around, so using burning veil on an army of reanimates will take quite a few castings.

Dark Power means you must keep it up, and probably requires a weapon switch.

Kraken Stance means you must keep it active in RMB slot. Every time you switch to cast something, you lose Kraken benefits.

Acid Fiends die on weapon switch, meaning you lose 2/4 weapon slots.

Sacrifices has a timer that interferes with Jitan's Gate and Bane. Forget about dunc, or any no-LOS teleport, as Bend the Shadows requires line of sight.

To top everything off, reanimates die after a short period of time. At least the ones created from Sacrifices.

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by The Big Ouchy on Sun Jul 13, 2014 5:59 am

@cowking wrote:
Bane has a CD that conflicts with Sacrifices and Jitan's Gate. You need a panic teleport, you can't cast Bane or Sacrifices for 10 seconds.

Totems need to be moved around manually unless you want to recast them 24/7 (after all, you want to keep your totems behind your minions so they're not instagibbed). This means you will be porting around with Bend the Shadows, giving you -50% DR, with no block, crappy defense, and no avoid. Also, your reanimates won't teleport with you.

Bend the shadows is your panic teleport. It has no timer so nothing should ever hit you ever... ever. You're also surrounded by at least 21 summons (5 jinn, 15 shadows, 1 void archon because if you don't use the debuff you're self gimping). Totems have rather incredibly high life at higher levels and they really wont get hit anyway what with all the several hundred reanimates that should be filling your screen. Minions also have innate avoid making them even tankier and all your summons get a giant life boost from shadows as it is in addition to the fact that pretty much every single necro you make should have max embalming for free % minion life.

@cowking wrote:Djinn's won't survive 5 seconds without full minion life/res dedicated gear. In fact, even with full minion gear, a lifespan of 5 seconds is probably a good estimate. Sadly, this will mean your defense is non-existent, due to absence of Death Ward.

Jinn actually start off with pretty high life. They are also shielded by all of your reanimates, come with an innate immunity to fire and they really aren't that difficult to recast anyways. It's an extremely small price to pay for doubling the elemental damage of your entire army. You also have literally nothing else to gear for once you have your desired reanimate(s) so minion life is an obvious gear dump. You should easily be able to get %800+. even with a lack of deathward defense is easy to obtain on a necro with the use of vizharan (lol 2 defense buffs) not that you need it anyways.

@cowking wrote:Reanimates are not 'leashed' minions that follow you around, so using burning veil on an army of reanimates will take quite a few castings.

By contrast, you certainly don't need to cast burning veil on all of them, especially if they are so far away from you due to their nonleashed nature that they aren't anyway near the enemies that you care about (the ones near you). This unleashed nature also allows for off-screen killing of enemies which is strictly a bonus rather than a downside.

@cowking wrote:Dark Power means you must keep it up, and probably requires a weapon switch.

Granted. It is actually completely obsolete once you get acid fiends anyways. I wouldn't use it but it is a nice additional buff to use while leveling and its always there as an option at least.

@cowking wrote:Kraken Stance means you must keep it active in RMB slot. Every time you switch to cast something, you lose Kraken benefits.

With all the spell damage buffs available to necromancers, kraken stance can make melee mobs do over 200k tri elemental damage per swing. I'll take the annoying skill switching any day of the week for that.

@cowking wrote:Acid Fiends die on weapon switch, meaning you lose 2/4 weapon slots.

They give everything a massive runspeed, attack speed, and elemental damage bonus, all of which exponentially increase your killspeed. What would you rather use instead?

@cowking wrote:Sacrifices has a timer that interferes with Jitan's Gate and Bane. Forget about dunc, or any no-LOS teleport, as Bend the Shadows requires line of sight.

Yeah mandatory teleports ruin a lot of neat builds sadly but you can compensate for it in those areas by running a spell as a backup (I personally love hailstorm). Not my favorite mechanic as it only really increases tedium rather than difficulty.

@cowking wrote:To top everything off, reanimates die after a short period of time. At least the ones created from Sacrifices.

And then you summon more.  Mr Green

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by RollsRoyce on Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:11 am

the barb version offers a real comfortable gameplay. Also up to 30k kraken stance dmg EACH element is more than enough to make your reanimates to dmg machines ( warforged shamans are somewhat godly as 25% reanimates).

But this runeword comes on a scythe and requires about 1000 Pgems to reroll a good reanimte ( yes it almost took me a week Very Happy).

While clearly being the most useful reanimator weapon we just need to think about character that can actually make a good use of a scythe + kraken stance

heres the point where i would exclude the assassin to be honest. then theres the the issue about the spell timer, we need an active spell that does not conflict with sacrifices.
For a barbarian you can use melee skills(what Homm did) or fortress (what i did).
Elemental skills cant be taken into consideration since you have a very high lvl kraken stance for free if you choose to use that scythe.

Treewarden might be a decent choice because you geta full heal everytime you cast sacrifices, also having this high lvl krakne stance will deal with EVERY phys immunity problem ever existed. => but ofc you have to stick to skills like whirlpool and gorefest to even be able to attack.

btw stance range is alright if you use the barb summoner belt + that scythe so this would be alright


Holy paladins best skills would be affected by cooldown so i would again exclude him as a viable option and using it on an unholy caster would kill its fast killspeed ( if you have 4fpa it seems weird to wait 7 seconds for sacrifices every time)

Sorceress ???? I really have no idea what could be done there

And last but not least the zon - maybe Orb of annihilation + reanimates as combination ...idk

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by cowking on Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:06 am

@The Big Ouchy wrote:
Bend the shadows is your panic teleport. It has no timer so nothing should ever hit you ever... ever.

Try fautz.

A build that can't do either dunc or fautz is not viable in my book. I guess this is where our confusion comes from.

I'll give +1 cookie to anyone who shows me a necro reanimator cleaning dest dunc or fautz with any kind of tolerable pace. Even a pure summoner would be worth a cookie.

The sad thing is, a parasite melee necro with basic set makes this look like a completely useless build in comparison.

The only reanimate that shows any promise for necro is Quov Tsin, but I lack the armor.

@RollsRoyce wrote:the barb version offers a real comfortable gameplay.

The advantage of barbs is their survivability. Anyone who has played necro summoner (which the reanimator practically is), knows how squishy summoners really are.

You want damage, you lose survivability.

You want survivability, you lose damage.

Add korean super saiyan 1337board skills.


Last edited by cowking on Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:23 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by archon256 on Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:20 am

@cowking wrote:fautz
Fauzt.
Fauz-tin-ville

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by RollsRoyce on Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:49 am

@archon256 wrote:
@cowking wrote:fautz
Fauzt.
Fauz-tin-ville

cookied Very Happy

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by grimjerk on Sun Jul 13, 2014 12:42 pm

Back to the general subject of the thread.

How 'bout the Deathknight who focuses on maximizing the utility of Massacre instead of Parasite? Massacre consists of 5 separate, stupid fast attacks so on attack procs cast like crazy.

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by munkyh3ad on Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:08 pm

Works good but breaks the scythe faster, knifes have even lower durability, an indestructible jewel is a must to avoid high cost of repairs.

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Re: Most Underrated build

Post by RollsRoyce on Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:27 pm

i tried that already, ended up using parasite Very Happy. But if someone comes up with some great ideas that would be awesome

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